262 replies to this topic

[VulcanFanatic]

Back on topic, WOW VF, the novelization doesn't hit until tomorrow? I wonder if they did something similiar when the Star Wars prequels came out, which could be why they released it later? I might pick it up and give it a read. How much is is selling for?

I found it at Walmart for $10.43, regular price on the book says $15.00. Its a oversized paperback, apparently there is no hardback version, which seems a little strange, but i dont care that much. I bought it, hopefully i can start reading sometime this week. Walmart only had four copies, Target had none and Barnes and Noble only had a few copies stuck down low on a shelf, not even in the "New" releases or any where prominent like that. You would think a movie with a $79 million opening weekend would get some respect.

[Wildcard]

Also do not forget that Pike went from Capt to Adm. Even Rear Adm is no less then 3 jumps.

Captain
Fleet Captain
Commodore
Rear Adm
Vice Adm
Adm
Fleet Adm
C in C (Commander in Chief)

Well keep in mind that Star Fleet in general has never really held 100% to any one set form of ranks. So it's possible that a few of these don't exist. As with anything Trek, until it makes it on screen, it's open to change.

One of those things is the PG-13 rating. They should have tried to get it as a PG film, as many viewers that might be buying the toys will not see the film and hence not buy the products. A guy I know won't let his six year old go, and that was when I was cutting my Trek teeth. This could easily backfire in toys sales.

You know, I can agree with you to a point on this. The few scenes that took this from a PG to PG-13 really weren't necessary. They DID add drive and tension to the scenes, but it would've been easy to eliminate. But I also have issues with the rating system to begin with. We can tons of violence in a PG film, but the first sign of blood or profanity and suddenly we're into R rating territory.

Just got back from seeing the movie. One question.....Did Scotty beam Porthos into outerspace or to a planet?? Everyone was laughing and I didn't hear the whole thing.

He was trying to beam "Admiral Archer's favorite beagle" (assuming that it's a Porthos descendant) over a vast distance...inter-planetary I believe, and he said that he'd "let [you] know when it rematerializes."

I was not one for the countdown series. Sadly it did fill in a lot of backstory that really should have been added to actual film. Im sure Nero and the Romulans confused a lot of the audiance as to why they were doing stuff. What I dont want to see with this franchise is what happens with movies like Spiderman....Star Trek 2 is going to be the klingons, gorn, and cardassians....Trek 3 is going to etc. I can totally see them trying to stuff multiple cameos/villians into one film just to do it without and major bearing on the story.

I'm with you on the much needed backstory. I did read Countdown as well, and while many aspects of it were wonderful, I too found it lacking. There were just a few elements that were throw away to me. And while I enjoyed the guest stars, a few felt a little too forced i.e. WORF!

Its a oversized paperback, apparently there is no hardback version, which seems a little strange, but i dont care that much.

Pocketbooks/CBS publishing has been VERY strange towards Trek over the past few years. They've passed on the idea for hardbacks many times when it would've been appropriate (this incident included). And don't get me started on their audio-books policies.

AS for the movie itself: Although I thoroughly enjoyed it, I found myself saddened as well. I was afraid that this was going to be a movie that completely changed the Trek universe, but I was also hoping that it would be a "fill in the gap" movie. Instead we got "Ultimate Universe Star Trek" which, granted, did NOT re-write the Trek universe, but still didn't show us the first coming together of the TOS cast. Nothing that we saw in this movie would be comparable to the TOS crew we knew.

And with the success of this film, we will no longer see anything (except novels) from the "Prime" trek universe, which also saddens me. I was still holding a candle for the chance at a mini-series or made-for-tv/direct-to-dvd movie for DS9, VOY, or ENT....or even another attempt at TNG. But this pretty much put an end to that.

Cast: I found Bones absolutely perfect! Scotty was wonderful too. Quinto and Pine were ok, I have issues, but I can overlook them to an extent (it's their take on the characters after all). My only real complaint, if you can call it that, is Uhura. I LIKE Zoe, and thought she portrayed a wonderfully strong, intelligent, and well rounded character. But she wasn't as regal or elegant as Nichele Nicols portrayal. And that was something that I considered to be a character aspect of Uhura herself. She came across a little too American Girl Next Door as opposed to the Swahili beauty. And I'm not going to start on the relationship thingy....NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO! I was hoping for an introduction of Christine Chapel and a more fulfilling pursuit of Mr. Spock in the next film.

The ship: I liked many things. I just wish that Main engineering had been a little bit better defined...which could be corrected in the next film. Also, the multipled warp cores kind of shocked me. But I did like the pipes and plant aesthetic.

The bridge didn't bother me as much as it had been once I saw it more completely...but I still could deal with a little LESS bright white lighting. It really WAS the Genius Bar.

Nero: He was a little too much of an empty villain. The comic book did provide a decent back story, but for the most part the movie didn't establish anything for him. I kept feeling like this was Shinzon rehashed.

Vulcan and Amanda: I am so distraught over these. I think they were bold moves, but IMHO wrong ones too. But I do see how Amanda's presence and absence from Spock's life.

The Kelvin saga DID bring a tear to my eye. Something that hasn't happened since Generations. Did anyone else happen to notice one of the aliens on the bridge with the tan skin and odd shapped face/head? I'm wondering if he/she couldn't have been from the same race as Lt. Arex from TAS. I actually got excited by that prospect. I would like to see Chapel, Rand, Arex, M'Ress, and maybe even Kyle etc. introduced in the next film.

[TheHSBR]

I did notice the Arex styled alien. I thought this film did a much better job with established a variety of species as opposed to other movies/tv shows that were humanoid with a little extra put on their face.

[JulesLuvsShinzon]

If they hadn't used him as the captain of the Kelvin, I would have said that actor would have been a cool Khan. Honestly though, I don't want to see Kumar or Khan for that matter. Let Kirk piss some new villain off by sleeping with his woman

How about a reboot for Roddenberry's vision of equality?

[JulesLuvsShinzon]

Nero: He was a little too much of an empty villain. The comic book did provide a decent back story, but for the most part the movie didn't establish anything for him. I kept feeling like this was Shinzon rehashed.

ER..no. Shinzon was an incredibly complex villain with diverse motives. A lot of people didn't get Shinzon but he was the most Shakespearean character who ever appeared in Trek.

[JulesLuvsShinzon]

One of those things is the PG-13 rating. They should have tried to get it as a PG film, as many viewers that might be buying the toys will not see the film and hence not buy the products. A guy I know won't let his six year old go, and that was when I was cutting my Trek teeth. This could easily backfire in toys sales.

It is a 12A here in the UK, and for no good reason that I can think of. PG at the very most.

[FHC]

Wildcard, all of those ranks have been used in either TOS or the TOS movies. For example Kirk in TMP was a Vice Adm.

[Hirogen]

I did notice the Arex styled alien. I thought this film did a much better job with established a variety of species as opposed to other movies/tv shows that were humanoid with a little extra put on their face.

Yes, it was nice to see very alien beings. But when I saw that one medical person with the large eyes in the beginning, I groaned.

[Gothneo]

This is the first time that we have a somewhat "all-star" cast and I wonder if this group will stick through thick and thin like the other crews have in the past?

Isn't the standard contract usually a 3 movie deal? So hopefully we'll see them together for at least 3...

Is it really an all star cast? (that is a rhetorical question!)

Don't get me wrong, I think they are perfectly cast and loved what most did with the characters, but Pine and Quinto combined don't have as much acting credits as Nimoy did when he was cast for TOS.

Pegg, Cho & Urban were the names I instantly recognized, and they all have many more credits under their belts. I kind of see Quinto, Pine, Saldana & Yelchin as rising stars.

Which really is brilliant if you ask me... 1/2 the cast are more seasoned and 1/2 the cast are fairly fresh to me.

I really loved the chemistry that Pine & Quinto were able to achieve, Urban was really good too, but we didn't quite get the full development of the relationship between Kirk, Spock AND McCoy... I got left feeling that McCoy ended up being the odd man out on date night.

I wouldn't mind seeing them pump out a couple more movies and then relaunch them all on a TV series!

[The_Donster]

I just read in Entertainment Weekly they're signed for 2 pictures at the moment. Something else I said, is there might be more of the philosophical(spell check) stuff in the next movie. BTW, can we merge these 2 threads now or at least merge them on Friday? If no one has seen the movie already, I say tough noogies on not avoiding the thread. I personally waited until I watched the movies to hit on any thread on all forums.

[Thomas E. Johnson]

I just read in Entertainment Weekly they're signed for 2 pictures at the moment. Something else I said, is there might be more of the philosophical(spell check) stuff in the next movie. BTW, can we merge these 2 threads now or at least merge them on Friday? If no one has seen the movie already, I say tough noogies on not avoiding the thread. I personally waited until I watched the movies to hit on any thread on all forums.

I agree the philosophical stuff is coming at us with a vengeance in the sequel. I thought they all signed on for 3 movies, with an option for 2 more after that? At least thats what I read.

[Cpt. Phil T. Berns]

ER..no. Shinzon was an incredibly complex villain with diverse motives. A lot of people didn't get Shinzon but he was the most Shakespearean character who ever appeared in Trek.

Look who's back. And she didn't change a bit.

[FHC]

I thought that would have went to Chang.

[Hirogen]

Interesting post at RTM, I thought you guys might like to hear how TPTB were going to include Shanter in the new movie.

http://www.toymania....ges/25291.shtml

I think that would have worked pretty well.

[Crayfish]

I have a quick spoiler question and I have not been able to find this anywhere. Over on the toy forum there is talk about what figure we would like to see and mine and a few other people's is Gaila (Uhura's Orion roommate). This got me to thinking:

Did Gaila get assigned to the Enterprise thus remaining alive or did she get put on another ship and is now dead?

[knightone]

She was assigned to another ship so, most likely, she was KIA.

[JonWes]

Poor Gaila... she looked so happy.

[knightone]

Look at it this way: She died in the line of duty. A Starfleet officer could ask for no better way to go. I like to think they gave a good (albeit short) fight before going down.

[Thomas E. Johnson]

She was assigned to another ship so, most likely, she was KIA.

Yeah, even if any of the crew from those ships made it out in escape pods, I don't think they could have gotten away from the black hole, and the Enterprise didn't have time to rescue any of them. However the Vulcan ships that did get away with the 6000 or so surviving Vulcans may have picked up whom ever they could in the time they had, so there is still hope for Gaila. I hope she survived, she was gorgeous!

[stardust]

I can easily enjoy a rip-roaring action adventure film replete with all variety of explosions and battles. However, I prefer the plot to hold together. When I first watched the film so much is going on that while I saw some problems I really didn't see the deficiencies in the film to the degree I did later because everything is moving so fast, maybe too fast. But once you see the film again or you sit back and try to make sense of all the stuff in the film and actually analyze the story the film really starts to have problems. Maybe the writers thought that with the whirlwind of events that occur in the film that you wouldn't catch on but I like to examine the story especially when it comes to these films or tv series that go out of their way to cover a lot of ground as it tends to be the preferred style these days.

I did love the exciting visual effects sequences--the Narada vs the Kelvin, Spock's ramming of the Narada with the ship from the future--, the epic visuals--Vulcan's destruction-- and inventive stunts like the atmospheric jump to the drill. I loved the updates on the TOS uniform. The colors were vibrant and rich and looked good on everyone. I didn't mind the cosmetic license the designers took with the Enterprise from either the interior or from the outside. I loved the clean white look and have ever since seeing it on the Prometheus from Voyager's "Message in a Bottle" and the Engineering set paid homage to the original and looked like I envisioned if it had a bigger budget. The Enterprise was a beauty to behold as was the Narada.

All the actors were well cast. I thought Chekov, McCoy, Kirk, Spock and Amanda did an excellent job capturing the mannerisms and essence of their original counterparts. Uhura felt a little different. On TOS, she was more of a gentle wilting flower or damsel-in-distress. Here she had a bit of spunk and sass which wasn't a bad thing. Scotty was a little over-the-top for my tastes. Doohan's Scotty was light-hearted and fun but Pegg needed to pull it back. From what little we saw this crew had chemistry and I liked all of them. In fact, I liked them so much I would have liked them to have had more focus. If there was one thing that I felt was missing was the emotion. Trek is at its best when mixing its humanity with the action. Even weaker Trek films like Generations or Insurrection had those moments of reflection that were pretty much absent here. This was mostly jumping from one action piece to the next with little time to absorb what happened.

I started to come to this conclusion when I realized I had intellectually recognized that the writers did something pretty bold and destroyed Vulcan yet it didn't emotionally register. It wasn't carry the kind of shock and impact it really should have viscerally. This is afterall a founding member of the Federation and a world that has been part of Trek since the beginning yet its destruction carried about as much resonance as a nameless planet of the week or destroying a planet in a video game. It wasn't a grim sequence a la ENT's "Twilight". It seemed the writers wanted to do something big and decided to destroy Vulcan but they didn't do enough to do the idea the justice it deserved. Heck, DS9 manged to generate more reaction from me with just hearing that Betazed was occupied by the Dominion on DS9. As I was trying to figure out why it donned on me that there was so much else going on around it got lost in the mix--it was just one of a thousand plot points. I think they crammed too much material into these two hours. By trying to do so many things none of them really receive the kind of development they deserved.

Yes, they tried to capture the loss with Spock in his scenes with Uhura and with Sarek but they didn't succeed for me. Not enough had been done to give those scenes the kind of richness demanded of them. And for a long time fan such as myself feeling this way I can only imagine the lack of resonance by the uninitiated who are just introduced to this race and its world. Same with Amanda's death, you really have to earn those emotional payoffs and just destroying a planet or killing off Spock's mother, which was a little iffy in its execution, doesn't automatically guarantee those expected responses especially since Amanda had sum total of about a minute of screentime and comes off no better than a redshirt. We had no reason to invest in it.

I also thought Nero was more of a plot device than a flesh and blood adversary. I would have liked more interesting/intriguing definition to his motivations. And while I didn't mind the time travel aspect to the story but could it have been any more basic. It preserves TOS/TNG/DS9/VOY/ENT and allows from here on out for Abrams to play around and bring in races that in the original timeline couldn't appear and do shocking things like destroy Vulcan which I was surprised by but I would have liked a more interesting scenario than simply Romulus being destroyed by a super nova. It felt like a big chunk of relevant information was missing in order to be able to understand why Nero was doing what he was doing. It was wafer thin. And it turns out there was something missing. What is up with shows or films providing supplemental and critical information regarding the storyline in extraneous sources like webisodes, podcasts, comic books, interviews. If it is important don't relegate it to someplace other than the actual film. Apparently that is what happened here. It was too bad we didn't get to see more of the late 24th century than the very brief glimpses via Spock's mind meld. It looks like there is some peace between the two worlds so to some extend Spock's efforts worked just how far we'll probaby never know.

Obviously, the writers didn't want to drag too much backstory from the Trek canon into the film but would it have been that confusing with a bit of exposition imparted to Kirk to catch up the new comers. I don't think so.

As far as Nimoy's Spock's inclusion it might have been handled better. When I heard he was going to be in the film and that we would see the origins of the TOS crew it seemed an interesting way to merge these is to have Spock on his deathbed remembering these individuals and reflecting on his life maybe via a mindmeld with someone. I think that might have been more interesting and certainly more poignant. Given that this in all liklihood will be the last time we ever see Old Spock I would have liked a more satisfying use of him other than as a plot device and a more satisfying sense of closure akin to Sarek's sendoff in "Unification". Here they left it open. I can understand why he wouldn't have attempted to open another hole given he had no idea where it would end up and I understand why the writers didn't bring up the slingshot from Star Trek IV. But if this is ever the last time we see Old Spock it's disappointing that he didn't receive a better curtain call. And I found it a tad too convenient Kirk runs into Old Spock and then Scotty the way they did but I like Scotty's little alien buddy.

The nods to ENT I could have taken it or left. I guess the writers didn't feel the need to honor Balance of Terror since everyone knew Romulans and Vulcans related and looked identical. I liked the idea of the Narada being a mining vessel--ties into Remus being a mining world. Nice tip of the hat to Pike being wheelchair bound. I didn't really like the updated transporter effect. At first I thought the teaser took place in the 24th century because the uniform reminded me of those worn in the "All Good Things" future. And what good is looking like a Romulan do if Spock is wearing a Starfleet uniform when he beamed over to the Narada. I guess Abrams decided to go back to Romulans looking like Vulcans without the forehead ridges. That's fine.

The Spock/Uhura romance I don't know what to make of it. It didn't get in the way but I'm not that into the idea but then we didn't get a lot of insight into and I thought the Orion looked awful.

I guess my one complaint is it lacked substance and despite all these issues I had fun and enjoyed myself but it wasn't all it might have been. It was too simple and bare bones without a lot of meat. As an action film it works as a Trek film it has its issues so I'm torn. I'd probably give it 2.5 stars out of 4.

I personally think Trek works better as a tv series. Most of the time after seeing a Trek film I leave not completely satisfied. The last one that really worked was Star Trek 6. This film is okay. It's not the best Trek film ever. It has issues that prevented me from being completely engrossed in the film as it unfolded. It's entertaining on a superficial level but it has its issues.