Captain Sisko w/ Defiant Captain's Chair!
#201
Posted 05 August 2009 - 02:49 PM
#202
Posted 05 August 2009 - 04:05 PM
#203
Posted 08 August 2009 - 03:00 AM
Andy, if it's not definitively canceled, and sites have it for pre-order, I'd pre-order a case of these if I thought it'd put the thing closer to the production run. I mean, this is an item I really want and I thought I wouldn't even be able to pre-order. If some places are still soliiciting pre-orders and DST is serious about seeing if more people will pre-order, I'll put a pre-order down as early as tomorrow. However, if DST can't tell us what they're doing, I don't want to get my hopes up again. I want this chair though, and whoever came up with the Worf variant actually has a pretty good idea. We've seen Kirk's chair run into the ground--we got Picard's chair w/Riker as a variant, so why not tap the variant possibilities? I'm all for more chairs and more Captains. Besides, I'm getting annoyed with how DST has neglected the 24th century stuff, if this chair has a remote possibility of being made, to me that's the first thing DST has done since canceling most 24th Century stuff after the Ent-D in ages. Again, I just want DST to say "yeah, we'll make the chair if you guys pre-order it;" to me, that'd be all I'd need to put pre-orders through to support the chair. Granted, I think DST needs to advertise Trek more, and not 23rd Century Trek since that's selling--if they advertised their TNG and DS9 stuff though, they'd probably get an influx if new customers who haven't seen it elsewhere. TNG marathons run every Monday on SyFy right before Gundam 00, and the 00 crowd would probably be just as likely to pick up the Trek stuff as the TNG crowd--DST could do toy commercials all Monday night on SyFy alone and probably generate more sales. But then again, this has been mentioned before IIRC.
#204
Posted 08 August 2009 - 12:12 PM
#205
Posted 09 August 2009 - 10:15 PM
I don't know of another toy company, but I can tell you about something similar. Earlier this year, Disney inexplicably failed to finish releasing Power Rangers Jungle Fury on DVD in the United States. Fans were perplexed, confused, and outright aggravated. After all, the previous season had seen a full season DVD release, and the "Jungle Fury" discs were structured as if they were meant for a full season release. Then to add insult to injury, Volumes 3-5 saw a release in the UK, effectively creating a full season release outside of the US/Canada. Fans were now livid and demanding answers. A source inside of TVShowsonDVD.com told one fan that the reason those of us who were "waiting for Vol. 3-5 stateside" hadn't seen any new discs, was because the second disc supposedly didn't sell as well as the first one, (which is what happens when YOU DON'T PROMOTE THINGS -- Disney and Diamond Select Toys I'm screaming at both of you,) and Disney decided to "silently cancel" Volumes 3-5 in the U.S., unless the first two volumes that were out "sold really well all of the sudden."
The fan backlash was almost immediate. Discs that hadn't been very high in the Amazon sales ranks prior to the release of this information magically shot up to the top-100 in the Sci-Fi category, in fact, Jungle Fury Vol. 1 seemed to maintain a position on that chart for a few months. (Disney has yet to release Vol. 3-5 stateside.) At the same time, "Power Rangers RPM," the current and final season was announced for its first DVD release. Again, fan reaction was immediate; now armed with the knowledge that "If Vol. 1 doesn't sell, we don't get Vol. 2" since Disney seems to have something against box sets, fans pre-ordered the disc almost as soon as it was announced. After that, they pre-ordered more of them--one person I knew pre-ordered three copies figuring he could resell them or give them to younger relatives. The concept here was simple: force the disc to sell so that Disney would release Vol. 2. Sure enough it seems to have worked. Vol. 2 is slated for a September 8, 2009 release, and fans will likely use the same tactic on Vol. 2 to ensure that Vol. 3 is produced. Why? Because Disney has only released one of 17 seasons worth of "Power Rangers" on DVD stateside, and the one that got the release was the 15th season, which was a Disney production. To say Disney treats "Power Rangers" the way Diamond Select Toys treats non-TOS Trek would be an understatement.
This brings me to my point: Just as Disney might not believe the DVDs fan so desperately want could be mass produced without some sort of pre-order guarantee, Diamond Select Toys might need a similar pre-order guarantee for Sisko+Command Chair. And like Disney, not wanting to anger fans who feel they're perpetually getting shafted with "Power Rangers" DVD releases, DST likely doesn't want to anger 24th Century Trek fans who feel like they're being fed TOS 24/7/365, and can't get a popular DS9 figure produced.
I don't think canceling Sisko+Chair right now is a good move though Andy; it'd just reinforce the mentality around here that "DST only cares about TOS," and that's aggravating a lot of people right now. Of course, I'd rather DST trickle out 24th Century releases than lose the license. I don't want Playmates Toys to get it back (see previous statement about the JJ-prise,) and I don't want to have to switch scales or styles of figures again. This should be DST's cornerstone line, why they can't market it as such is beyond me. Maybe a new TV show would help, if they'd actually secure the license this time, now that Trek is "cool" again.
#206
Posted 09 August 2009 - 10:48 PM
#207
Posted 10 August 2009 - 09:04 AM
My point (especially for those that don't know Buffy well) is that there are many collectors who would love to be completists if their budget was better...but they can't be. So, they decide to collect one of each character and then make exceptions on a case by case basis.
I think this is why Sisko/chair sales were low...it was too similar to the other Sisko figure (with Dukat) and they split their sales base because many collectors would only have bought one or the other. The Borg wave also suffered the "build-a-base" because I know there are more people like me who were only interested in the characters and less interested in nameless army-builders. I realize there are those that DO want red-shirts and drones...but I think DST over-estimated how many per wave would sell well. Plus...to some degree I think those who like to build armies find the "building" part to be part of the fun...so why not make named characters and give the custom-folks parts to swap in that way.
Solution...market the Sisko/Chair so it sells...and give us a Dukat/Kai Winn two pack.
#208
Posted 14 August 2009 - 09:07 AM
#209
Posted 14 August 2009 - 09:26 AM
Well, the page doesn't say canceled like the Borg wave, but it does say out of stock. Granted, I doubt anyone was pre-ordering through them anyways since they wanted $25 instead of BBTS' $20, but yeah... Removal from the site probably means it's done for. Just can't win with their ridiculous policies now.
How can they stand to constantly do this and not change their attitude?
#210
Posted 14 August 2009 - 09:39 AM
Well, the page doesn't say canceled like the Borg wave, but it does say out of stock. Granted, I doubt anyone was pre-ordering through them anyways since they wanted $25 instead of BBTS' $20, but yeah... Removal from the site probably means it's done for. Just can't win with their ridiculous policies now.
How can they stand to constantly do this and not change their attitude?
http://www.diamondse.....ategoryID=335
Yeah, but they removed it from the selection of action figures on their website Lets all hope that they promote figures better from now on...
#211
Posted 14 August 2009 - 09:47 AM
Honestly, I think they've even been lying about the success, or rather, alleged lack of success for Deep Space 9 figures in general.
#212
Posted 14 August 2009 - 11:14 AM
Honestly, I think they've even been lying about the success, or rather, alleged lack of success for Deep Space 9 figures in general.
You know, I am past the point of even caring anymore. I would rather spend my money on DCUC now and Star Wars that come out regularly.
#213
Posted 14 August 2009 - 02:08 PM
#214
Posted 14 August 2009 - 11:09 PM
#215
Posted 16 August 2009 - 08:24 PM
I think the set has been canceled for awhile, Just because a few sites like BBTS are really slow at updating their website is little reason to get upset.
DST really got it's start with comic shop specialty items like busts, statues etc... and then went in to action figures like Marvel Select. If they tank they will probably just collapse back to these types of products.
But these types of products have never really had much a schedule. they come when they come. So from that view, DST is operating as it always has, and will most likely continue to.
DST is not Hasbro or Mattel. Heck, I doubt that toys even make up the bulk of DST's sales. Likewise Hasbro and Mattel have their issues, but they certainly don't "Sabotage" their own lines. We, as collectors have to wake up and realize that the economics of making these types of toys/collectibles has drastically changed over the last few years. Many smaller companies, some really good ones, have gone out of business. Hasbro and Mattels margins have been severely slashed, not just because cost of materials is higher, but because manufacturing, shipping, etc costs have risen. Heck I was just talking with an "Insider" the other day and they were telling me that part of Mattels problem with distribution of the DCUC line has been Factories in China closing down. When a factory closes shop in China, the retailer that put up the money gets screwed. This is why we have been seeing older waves of DCUC stocked. Retailers like it, it's selling, but Mattel can't actually get them made! And by the way when these things happen, Mattel looses huge amounts of money because they PAID the factory up front. and got nothing!
I'd be willing to bet good money that if it's happened to Mattel, it's happened to DST... and it probably is some of the stories that DSTChuck would regal once you got a couple drinks in him!
The final note is that I have no doubt that DST, like hasbro and Mattel is in this to make money, and they can't do it if they don't have new product continuously coming out... so I believe they are doing their best, but sometimes their best isn't enough and a product has to be canceled. Something to be disappointed over? To be sure! But don't let it get you angry! It'll just detract from what is supposed to be an enjoyable hobby!
#216
Posted 17 August 2009 - 06:29 AM
I think the set has been canceled for awhile, Just because a few sites like BBTS are really slow at updating their website is little reason to get upset.
DST really got it's start with comic shop specialty items like busts, statues etc... and then went in to action figures like Marvel Select. If they tank they will probably just collapse back to these types of products.
But these types of products have never really had much a schedule. they come when they come. So from that view, DST is operating as it always has, and will most likely continue to.
DST is not Hasbro or Mattel. Heck, I doubt that toys even make up the bulk of DST's sales. Likewise Hasbro and Mattel have their issues, but they certainly don't "Sabotage" their own lines. We, as collectors have to wake up and realize that the economics of making these types of toys/collectibles has drastically changed over the last few years. Many smaller companies, some really good ones, have gone out of business. Hasbro and Mattels margins have been severely slashed, not just because cost of materials is higher, but because manufacturing, shipping, etc costs have risen. Heck I was just talking with an "Insider" the other day and they were telling me that part of Mattels problem with distribution of the DCUC line has been Factories in China closing down. When a factory closes shop in China, the retailer that put up the money gets screwed. This is why we have been seeing older waves of DCUC stocked. Retailers like it, it's selling, but Mattel can't actually get them made! And by the way when these things happen, Mattel looses huge amounts of money because they PAID the factory up front. and got nothing!
I'd be willing to bet good money that if it's happened to Mattel, it's happened to DST... and it probably is some of the stories that DSTChuck would regal once you got a couple drinks in him!
The final note is that I have no doubt that DST, like hasbro and Mattel is in this to make money, and they can't do it if they don't have new product continuously coming out... so I believe they are doing their best, but sometimes their best isn't enough and a product has to be canceled. Something to be disappointed over? To be sure! But don't let it get you angry! It'll just detract from what is supposed to be an enjoyable hobby!
Thank You. I agree 100% with this statement. If it is making you that unhappy then move on.
#217
Posted 17 August 2009 - 11:03 AM
Not that it's too hard to move on if they're not actually releasing product...
#218
Posted 17 August 2009 - 11:04 AM
Honestly, I think they've even been lying about the success, or rather, alleged lack of success for Deep Space 9 figures in general.
Why would they do that? I don't understand. How does it benefit them at all to NOT release product, and/or kill a line like that? They get paid on what they put into our hands, not what they promise and pull back out on. If they want to kill the line because it isn't making money, they can simply stop producing figures and say some variation of "sorry, we know some of you out there like it, but we just can't make it work." .... which, is exactly what they're doing. If they have a successful line, why kill the goose?
I doubt that any of the Star Trek figures are selling badly in terms of raw numbers, but I do believe that they are selling terribly in terms of profit, which is all that really matters. I have no data to back this up, but it wouldn't surprise me if we were to find out that Star Trek was, by leaps and bounds, either the most expensive franchise out there, or perhaps a close second to Star Wars, with both SW an ST being orders of magnitude more expensive than anything comparable. As much as Paramount might like to think so, Trek does not even come close to Wars in terms of consumer sales. Perhaps it did in its heyday, but not today, and that's probably what's burning DST.... or at least, that's my theory... but regardless, if it doesn't make economic sense to continue the line, why jump through these hoops, and if it does, why anger the fans by killing the line so haphazardly. It just doesn't make sense to me...
#219
Posted 17 August 2009 - 12:12 PM
As well, wave 2 is sold out on their own site (excluding the previews exclusive). Granted, the wave is still widely available and even clearanced one some sites, but that doesn't really count; DST has already been paid for those. What counts is whether or not DST can get rid of their own supply, and apparently they have. That evidence seems to suggest that there is significant interest in DS9, just not for pre-orders - which they are far too fixated on. If they're focusing on how often these waves were pre-ordered instead of focusing on how they sold after getting released then, yeah, I can see where the "low interest" claim is coming from. However, people don't want to pre-order because it took so long to get those waves anyways due to annoying, and mostly unexplained delays.
That's where the lying bit comes in... DST doesn't want to admit it's their mistake as to why pre-orders are low, so they claim low customer interest in the actual line. That way they can still make the line at their own pace, but the responsibility is put on us whether or not it actually gets produced. Meanwhile, they continue to go through the same lengthy delays, and don't even directly inform us whether or not an item is officially canceled.
I'm sure I could easily be wrong, though, and I welcome that.
#220
Posted 17 August 2009 - 01:12 PM
Back on topic of the Sisko in chair...and pre-orders in general...does anyone know what to do regarding Toy Rocket pre-orders? Now that they're bankrupt, is AA/DST counting those orders in their overall numbers? Can we rely on the orders we've placed? (Should this be a separate thread?)
Has anyone asked if DST would consider releasing just the chair? I suppose they assume it would sell worse than the set with figure included...but I can't remember if that's ever been discussed.
1 user(s) are reading this topic
0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users