New prediction! Somehow the time crystal will save them all but set Starfleet back 100 years in technology. The Enterprise will magically transform into it's original aesthetic!
PS, I at least have to hand it to them, Pike knowing his future is about the only interesting dimension that could have been added to his whole storyline.
Pike facing destiny and choosing it despite the ramifications was a nice touch... I think it could have been more impactful. where I think the writers got lazy was by adding the extra caveat that by taking the crystal, your destiny is now locked in and pre-determined, which for pike, as a viewer we know this, but thats 4th wall knowledge. All they really needed to do was to explain that most people can't handle seeing what fate/the future/etc has in store for them and an internal struggle... ala DS9 "Shadows and Symbols" would have been perfect.
If Discovery ends up stranded in the distant future, but the crew is not there, apparently the crew get back somehow? Or leave it...
But...either way...how does this series have a 3rd season???
One thing they could do that would be pretty awesome...so awesome that I know those bozos won't do it...would be if they take it into the post-VOY, but not too distant, future, and now we get to have a series that was both set toward the beginning of, and after, the pre-existing prime canon. "The best of both worlds", lulz. Bring fat old admiral Riker on for some cameos, Janeway, etc. Have Discovery future-fitted and have them on special missions with their sphere data or something. That would make me forgive all sins thus far.
Either way I guess the reason Spock never speaks of his sister would be that because if people knew she went to the future they could lie in waiting to jeopardize the mission. Though you would think he could talk about his sister without talking about the mission. So I'm not sure I agree with that as a "perfect answer".
I thought exactly the same. We got another episode of The Orville... I find that show not only more entertaining but more coherent. Your idea Whirlygig maybe the only way to salvage much of anything.
Well, I'm sad that according to Kurtzman the jump is almost 1000 years forward instead of closer to post-VOY...and also a bit perplexed why they think that's a good idea... what sort of stories will they tell that far out? It will be a mistake if they make it look like it's more or less same old same old minus a few disbanded organizations or realigned alliances...make it look like we more or less "spun our wheels" for 1,000 years...that doesn't seem like what Star Trek set out to depict either. If they do that then why'd it have to be so far out, is my point.
That’s a terrible idea. The great thing about only going forward 50 or so years is they have the ability to start with a fairly fresh slate while keeping continuity. Going forward that far will create more issues imo. I hate to say it but, after a decade of “new trek”... and really trying to give it the benefit... I’ve mostly been disappointed. Luckily I’ve got years of TNG, DS9 and VOY i can watch and enjoy.
I liked Season 2 way more than the first. I want to go back and watch both again. The pace was sometimes really quick. I also want to evaluate the show after knowing where everything was leading in each season. That way I can judge things for as they were and maybe ignore any of my expectations that werent met. I still think some of the issues I have with the story will remain.
I loved Pike, the Enterprise, and those blue phaser beams! Culber and Stammets (spelling?) were never favorites but their scene in the finale really moved me. I feel like those two have it dialed in now. Im curious to see where they go in season 3. Personally happy they are moving to a time where canon really doesnt matter.
4/5. I really enjoyed the storyline, and am very curious what theyll do next season. Weve had some small snippets of that time period with Daniels on Enterprise, but its still essentially a blank slate.
The technical production of both seasons is fantastic... I give that a 4 just because... well lens flares and prostectically distracting Klingons.
Trek has a good history of getting quality actors, and Disco is no exception... and again I think I’d go 4 in this area and love issacsLorca and Mounts pike, as well as a number of others.
The weak point for me is the writing. We’ve had glimmers of good... but overall I Can’t give the writing more than a 2... and that might be generous.
So a total score would probably be 2.5 or 3 just because I think a good story is so important.
I know I'm probably going to get some hate with my answer to this question, but...
Season 1: 2/5 Stars (Maybe 2.5 out of 5 if I'm being really generous because of the fairly awesome second half)
Season 2: 3–4/5 Stars
My reason for potentially ranking season 2 so scathingly low is all about the writing and that thing they keep trying to pass off as the Enterprise. (The updated aesthetic bugs the hell out of me, especially since they had an outright perfect plot–point that could have explained the TOS retro aesthetic if anyone in the writers room had been thinking.) Pike was awesome, but that's because Anson Mount is awesome. I almost wish they had made him a new character though since he could have easily carried DSC forward if they'd done so and kept him around. While the season as a whole was exponentially better than the first season, it still suffers from some really botched plotlines that just hurt it for me overall.
Spoiler
The first of these is Ariam's death, primarily because most people watching probably had no clue her name was "Ariam" up until about an hour before she died. This is a consistent problem with DSC, where Michael Burnham is the center of the universe, and everyone on the bridge not named Saru or Tilly (or Pike and Spock in season 2) is effectively scenery. Detmar is slowly becoming a character instead of a human bulkhead, but that should have happened long ago. Even ENT made it so that you knew every character's name before the first season was over, and the fact that DSC can't do that says a lot about what kind of show it is. As for Ariam's death being a "botched plotline," it's botched because you barely get to know her before the writers killed her. She's given about as much character development as an above average redshirt. If they'd developed her the way they developed Tilly, this would have actually hurt a lot more.
The second botched plot point is the tail end of the finale. Leland is Control, the whole point of going to the future is so Leland can't get the sphere data. Once Leland is on Discovery, that sort of becomes a moot point unless you get him off of Discovery, which isn't happening as the wormhole is being opened. This isn't the worst of it though: Emperor Georgiou kills Leland/Control in fantastic fashion, reducing him to scrap metal near the Spore Drive controls. At this point his entire armada stops functioning and is basically dead in space. We also get a communication telling us that "Control has been neutralized." It's only after this though that the ship is flung into the future! If the whole point of going to the future was to get the sphere data away from control and control no longer exists, why bother going a thousand years in the future still? I could have tolerated this if after everything that happened, the various crews all sort of spoke and agreed that the possibility that control might have survived somewhere outside of Leland was enough of a danger to send Discovery to the future, and to then lie to Starfleet about it as we saw in the final scenes of the season. I would have applauded this further if we'd gotten a line about downgrading all computers and systems in Starfleet as a precaution as well, effectively explaining the TOS aesthetic.
Also, and please let me know if I missed something here, but isn't Tyler supposed to be dead in the eyes of the Klingons? If so, why is he on L'Rell's ship, and why did we not see any pushback to his involvement here? It feels like we should have had 15 episodes like in season one instead of 14, and one should have been all of the maneuvering Tyler had to do behind the scenes to get the Ba'oul and Klingons to help the Federation, but then again, a lot of this season felt rushed because of the low episode count that's standard for DSC.
The writing did improve this season, despite my complaints above, but it could still be so much better. I felt like the season was solid overall, but they fumbled at the last second in the finale, which hurts my overall view of the season. It was still pretty good, but the more egregious screw–ups ruin an otherwise awesome season.
Speculation about season 3:
Spoiler
Okay, so now that DSC has won the Janeway award for reset button mashing, (sorry, not even Janeway hit the reset button as hard as DSC did at the end of this past season,) I have a couple of theories about season three. Let's start with what we already know: Burnham's Mom jumped 950 years from where she was presumed dead. Burnham notes that was 20 years from DSC season 2, which means Discovery should be jumping 930 years into the future, at least for the season premiere. This would put Discovery in the year 3187, assuming that DSC S2 was set in 2257 as has been implied.
We know that the U.S.S. Discovery is supposedly going to try and find its way back to 2257 or as close to where it left the timeline as it can get. At least that was the plan that was suggested once the ship offloads the sphere data somewhere.
Keeping the two points above in mind, I believe we could see Discovery offload the sphere data fairly quickly. I could also see a large portion of the season being oddly Voyager–esque with the crew trying to find their way home. Having said that, I think the bigger question is going to be whether they leave the year 3187 in the middle of the season, or at the end of it. I could honestly see it being in the middle of the season specifically because it's such a jump into the far future that staying there too long is going to do more harm than good for the show. Likewise, I think the writing team is smart enough to know that they're going to want to tie DSC into the events of the upcoming Picard series, and if that's the case, I could see them trying to jump back to some time around 2257, but somehow "undershooting" things and winding up in 2389/2399 or whatever year the Picard series takes place in, effectively tying the two shows together. We know that the Spore Drive can time travel in some capacity, because it did in season one on the way back from the mirror universe. Given that Picard was familiar with Spock, this would actually tie in rather nicely, and with the sphere data off of the ship, it would allow Starfleet to finally learn what really happened to the U.S.S. Discovery.
What I don't think we'll see, but we absolutely should, are the origins of ENT's temporal cold war. Think about it, we have a time traveling ship, and a bunch of very valuable sphere data. I could see that touching off some sort of conflict, especially as Discovery tries to get home. Did we ever learn what was houses in the dyson spheres that the sphere builders had constructed in ENT? Perhaps they held the data spheres like the one that downloaded its data into Discovery. Heck, execute the story properly and you could even make someone like Stamets ENT's "Future Guy." This would actually be a really cool way to use canon and finish off a story that could be easily tied into the current story by a fairly competent writer, but I don't think the current writing team would want to touch ENT, and I doubt the studio would want to go near it either. Sadly, this would be the perfect opportunity to expand on the TCW arc, especially if the writing team decided not to somehow put Discovery in the same era as the Picard show once all is said and done.
I know I need to watch the finale again, maybe some of the things that irked me the first time through won't get to me on a second viewing and it'll be a firm 4/5 star season for me instead of a 3–4/5 star season.
Also, (and this is just a side–irk of mine,) why the -insert colorful metaphor or choice here- can I not pre–order DSC S2 on Blu–Ray yet!? Seriously, The Orville hasn't even shown its season finale yet, but I can preorder the DVD release of season two right now, and could have done so at least as early as last weekend. Meanwhile DSC S2 is over and I still can't even preorder the Blu–Ray set. I "get" not having it ready to go yet, and I wouldn't even mind another November release date, but at least let me order the thing now while its fresh in my mind. The DVD and Blu–Ray releases should go live for preorder within a week of the finale airing, not months later. If you didn't sign up for CBS All–Access to watch the show when S2 premiered, you're probably not signing up now, and even if you were, the Blu–Ray/DVD release could still be set for so much later in this year that you'd want to sign up to see the show sooner and then grab it on disc later. Not being able to preorder it now though is irritating, and I was equally irritated with the way the season one release was only announced months after the finale had aired. I know this is a minor complaint, but its irritating, and I would think you'd get more sales if you could run an add at the end of Such Sweet Sorrow, Part 2 that just says something like "pre–order DSC S2 on DVD/Blu–Ray now, coming this November" effectively giving fans an incentive to do just that while the finale is fresh in their minds.
One last minor complaint: I hate the 2:1 aspect ratio! I get it, DSC is locked into this ratio for the long haul now, but I really hope that the Picard series uses a normal 16:9 aspect ratio instead. I know this is a minor thing that's not a huge issue, but it's the one technical aspect of the show that drives me crazy for multiple reasons.
2:1 is a nonstandard ratio! Just because Netflix is stupid and decides to use it doesn't mean that CBS AA should emulate their bad behavior.
Because of the point above that 2:1 is a nonstandard aspect ratio, it effectively forces the show to be arbitrarily letterboxed even on a "normal" widescreen TV. There are no TVs that use the 2:1 aspect ratio for the aforementioned reason, nor are there any computer monitors that use this as a native ratio. There are also no plans to ever make 2:1 a standard aspect ratio, to produce 2:1 TVs, or to produce 2:1 computer monitors.
2:1 is just irritatingly slightly off an actual aspect ratio standard to be annoying. 1.9:1 is the standard used by Digital Cinema Initiatives (DCI) cameras in various resolutions. It was chosen specifically because it crops well to 16:9 (A.K.A. 1.78:1) and 2.39:1, which is what's used for most 35mm film releases in the United States, as well as virtually every other widely used aspect ratio that's treated as a standard.
The show doesn't need to be any wider than a normal widescreen TV. ENT was frequently viewed with black bars because it had to be letterboxed to fit on our standard definition TVs, but it wasn't the desirable way to view the series. It was letterboxed because ENT had embraced a new standard. DSC is not doing that, (see above comments,) it's being different for the sake of being different.
Because DSC goes from deep blacks to bright whites, it draws attention to the edges of the image where the letterboxing occurs unnecessarily, which also takes away from some of the tighter shots.
Again, I know it's minor, but I just hate this oddball aspect ratio that wants to be 1.9:1 but isn't. I could actually live with the show being 1.9:1, as that would suggest that the people involved in the production wanted to use the full image without cropping anything, but for the true 2:1 that this show is shot in you pretty much have to crop the image anyway. I'm not even against letterboxed widescreen Trek, and would be fine with 1.85:1 or 2.39:1 if you really wanted to go with motion picture ratios. My beef is specifically with 2:1 and the people who keep trying to make it "a thing" when it's not.
Good analysis Alex. I’m pretty much in agreement... though aspect ratio doesn't really bother me. I did watch the finale again... and if anything I found many of the action scenes overly drawn out and almost comically at times.
So.. I re-watched DISCO S2 this last week. It was nice to re-visit it after letting it sit awhile.
New Eden is still that standout Episode of the Season for me.
Aston Mount is still perfect and Awesome as Pike.
The whole "Red Angel / Control" story line is overly complex and obfuscates some great moments
I was pondering why I liked New Eden so much, and I think the reason is that much of the season everyone is so manic... so busy trying to solve this or that problem... its so manic, that, the stress and anxiety would quickly break anyone. While New Eden was a bit bit more relaxed, and allowed you to explore the personalities of the characters... This element was in most previous Trek Writing, and is even a part of The Orville... so I have to wonder if this style isn't some of what many fans miss??
Hang on now... I submit Superman II as same basic time traveling plot plot... both instances use a celestial body And some fantastical way of using it to reverse time.
Superman wasn't using the Earth as anything but a reference point, like watching a TV screen while you rewind a videotape. He was in space because he needed the room to fly ludicrously fast. Geez.
It was interesting reading the criticisms leveled at this show, most of which were purely aesthetic. It seems that toy collectors crave visual continuity more than other Trekkies.
I've also come to the conclusion that, while it's often stated that it takes a Trek show three seasons to "find its footing," it really takes Trek fans three seasons to adjust to a new show because they don't readily embrace change.