25 replies to this topic

[VulcanFanatic]

I think when you aim that stuff specifically at young people to attarct them in, I would agree. There's a marked difference though in the way sex and violence is aimed at somebody of my age because I'm not addicted to sex and violence, and I demand a good reason for its inclusion. In NuBSG it is always properly justified.



Perhaps Singer will find a pretty woman to play the prostitute in order to be true to the original moral tone of old BSG!!!

Seriously, you can't classify all sex on TV as "filth" - because sex is healthy when practiced in loving respectful relationships of whatever duration. Without it we don't have our families. Whenever casual sex is shown in NuBSG, we, the audience, get to decide if the act is well-advised or not. Besides, there are plenty of family-friendly movies out there, high-toned morality won't play out for the likely target audience of a big sci-fi action movie.

Yes, there was a prostitute on the original BSG, but how many scenes did you see with her in the sack with anyone? There is a difference in having someone who is a prostitute on a tv show and having her sleep with half or more of the crew on screen. Cassiopea was ashamed of her profession and gave it up to become a nurse after the first episode if i remember correctly. The prostitute profession was not portrayed as something that was okay to engage in like many shows these days seem to make it look like.

[JulesLuvsShinzon]

Maybe you should go back and read what I said about the original marketing strategy for OldBSG and then ask yourself why there needed to be so few female characters - one being a prostitute? In a "family" show? Let's be clear, regardless of what happened later onto the character, Cassiopiea was a glamourous prostitute placed in that scenario to exercise the more "virtuous" Athena and act as a distraction to the male characters as part of some kind of more "adult" take on fleshing out sci-fi characters, and adding sex to a nerd medium in a much more obvious way than even Star Trek had done in TOS.

Of course, you'd excuse her presence there simply because she felt "ashamed" of her former life and redeemed herself be becoming a "proper" nurturing woman - I note a nurse and not a doctor - in the manner of some tedious, one-sided moral lesson since I see, once again, that you confine your commentary to her prostitute status and don't suggest that any of the blame lay with her johns, or men in general, some of whom seem to need the sex industry - they don't call it "the World's Oldest Profession" for nothing and where there is demand there will also be somebody desperate to supply it. Maybe there should be a debate about why, in fact, Cassiopeia should feel ashamed, or any more ashamed than her customers?

And while you didn't actually see Cassiopiea copping off with anyone, that's not really the point is it? She was still a prossie and Count Balthar was sexual libertine and epicurean. Back in 1979 it wasn't common currency to have bed scenes in mainstream shows. Times have changed since then, and in many ways, more honestly because NuBSG was never in the business of claiming to be a family show. It's a show for adults who have mostly got personal and practical knowledge of what they're seeing on screen. Crikey nobody over the age of eighteen ought to be surprised or wondering about anything they see Balthar or Starbuck getting up to!! And maybe nobody under 16 should be watching it. Period.

Anyway, I'm not sure a garish, cartoonish redux of a dubious and laughably camp TV show is going to pull in audiences. It's inevitably going to be compared with Moore's BSG and that has been such a critical success. It's also worth noting that the darker and more violent take on Batman has been the movie that has thrilled critics and audiences alike. Returning to a kind of Holy Arc in Space take on BSG would be like returning Batman to the days of Adam West and "Holy....!!!!"

[VulcanFanatic]

Returning to a kind of Holy Arc in Space take on BSG would be like returning Batman to the days of Adam West and "Holy....!!!!"

I think that is a bit of an extreme statement dont you think? Adam West's Batman was campy and tame as opposed to Christian Bales insane and immoral character. Original BSG was a serious, noble, moral drama, nothing like campy Batman.

[JulesLuvsShinzon]

^^^No, I don't think that is an extreme statement at all. I think it is accurate. I don't think lighthearted superhero fare with a one-sided morality will work in today's complex society. West's Batman didn't deal with the reality of crime and violence in the same way that OldBSG didn't reflect the realities of going to war with any enemy you don't understand. Old BSG won't work in a post 9/11 world unless one is of a limited mindset because there is no such thing as "noble" in this world anymore, only differing points of view about what nobility is.

Bales' Batman is, in fact, a character struggling with his own notions of morality. I don't think he is immoral, I think he is as amoral as the society in which he is endeavouring to administer some justice.

For a start, morality itself has become a lot more complex. If you're not religious, and I'm not in any sense that you'd recognise, then a one-size- fits-all- cookie-cutter Christian morality won't cut the mustard. We live in an increasingly pluralist society and it behooves us to understand different religions and moral codes even of we don't subscribe to them personally. That's what NuBSG does.

You may not understand it, but in point of fact, NuBSG carries with it a strong message about morals. It may not be a recognisable endorsement of one version of morality, but it advances the debate. In fact, NuBSG looks at conventional morality and how it works in extremely testing conditions. Bill Adama is, in fact, an extremely moral leader, as is Laura Roslyn. If you could interview either character, I don't think they would describe themselves as moral, but they would tell you that they endeavour to remain human and work for the good of the whole to the best of their ability. Some of the Cylons are intensely moral. NuBSG reflects a situation where religions collide and explores alternate morality. It gives the enemy Cylons back the "humanity" they were stripped of in OldBSG and challenges the audience to view an enemy in terms of what makes us the same and not what makes us different.

The fact that you've concentrated upon the amount of sex in the show and judged the women and not the men, pretty much endorses the reason as to why Moore's BSG is one of the most intelligent shows on TV. In other words, like Gaius Balthar, you have become distracted by sex - if for the opposite reason - and it has blinded you to the many virtues of a show that is addressing morality in terms of ideal standards and what human beings are really able to achieve, as well as how they fail.

[Prometheus]

I am a fan of Singers "Superman Returns", because it was made in the style of the original Superman movies, which i also like. When i saw the movie, i was pleasantly surprised that someone in hollywood actually cared about preserving something rather than trying to make it different. That being said, i hope any future Battlestar Galactica movie with also hearken to the original as well. improving the original is fine, throwing it out the window and completely changing it is not. I like series that you dont have to be ashamed to watch with the kids in the same room. If i want to watch skanky women sleep with everyone on the show, i will turn on an HBO channel, let us have a family friendly, intelligent scifi drama like the original series was. I looked forward to each episode every week and was thrilled every time i watched it. For those who are not old enough or missed it first run back in the day, the thrill may not be there as much now because 30 years have passed and technology is better. The staggering cost of the show back then (1 million an episode) was a big part of the reason it was canceled, along with a less than desirable timeslot. I hope this turns out to be a great movie, and i will actually pay money to go see it, and that honor is pretty rare these days, due to high cost of movie tickets and sorry selection of movies that interest me these days in the theater.

Don't get me wrong...I love Ron Moore's Galactica...but like what VF said..... It would be cool if someone did a Galctica that paid homage to the Original Series... Where the Cylons are Aliens, They shoot blasters instead of guns, The Earth is out there somewhere....and Baltar is a REAL bad guy !

[JulesLuvsShinzon]

I guess it depends upon whether or not you feel that the original BSG was iconic enough to deserve homage - I would say that it doesn't. Even in its cheesiest moments it barely nudges the campest moments in TOS, so it fails on both levels for me.

Apart from the nostalgia some of you might feel for simpler times in which you could tell goodies from baddies, cowboys 'n' indians in space doesn't really work anymore. I think what confuses a lot of people - and I have had so many heated discussions about this - is that NuBSG (and programmes like it) won't make the decision about whose side to be on for you. It simply throws you into the mix and you have to decide which characters are more likeable / hateful than others and makes you weigh the evidence rather than channelling you into making predictable and reductive moral judgements.

The lack of obvious villains and heroes in NuBSG keeps the afficionados watching because each week the plots weave to reveal new things about each character that are bound to make you feel differently about them week on week. They do something surprising: show kindness where you never expected them to, or they disappoint you - just like real people. No, Gaius Balthar is not entirely a bad guy, and even Galactica's key fly in the ointment - booze-hound Tighe - has his moments where the audience can almost - almost feel some empathy with him. NuBSG lets you know that the Colonials brought the conflict on themselves, and often the Cylons are the ones you empathise with.